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Photos and Memories of Edinburgh Talk to Newhaven Community History Group 19 November 2013 |
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Photos and Memories of Edinburgh |
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Photos and Memories of Edinburgh Talk to Newhaven Community History Group 19 November 2013 |
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5. Photos and Recollections of Edinburgh |
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- East Thomas Street - Fountainbridge - Granton - Joppa - St Leonard's
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PLEASE NOTE: So far, I've only completed this page for the headings underlined above. I may complete the other sections later. - Peter Stubbs: November 13, 2013 |
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DUMBIEDYKES A few extracts from Recollections |
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© Reproduced with acknowledgement to Ron Leckie, California, USA |
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Coal Lorry Accident Here is a lorry that ran away, out of control, down Arthur Street at Dumbiedykes and into Holyrood Park. These are some of the memories that people have sent to me about the event: |
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1 The Leckie Family "I grew up in Edinburgh, part of the Leckie coal family at St. Leonards. I have lived in California since 1976. On your site, you have recollections of Leckie’s lorry careening down Arthur Street in the Dumbiedykes. So I submit to you the photo of the resulting crash into the park, with kids hovering to pick up the coal without the policeman seeing them. Ron Leckie, California, USA: July 11, 2007 |
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2 The Accident "I remember the day well, when my Dad came home very stressed-out with that story. He was just so relieved that nobody got hurt. Apparently, the brakes were set and wheels turned into the curb – but the vehicle just slid on the wet cobblestones without its driver, the angle of that steep street overcoming the friction between the rubber and the cobblestones. Well, that was the story I heard. " Ron Leckie, California, USA: July 11, 2007 |
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3 Memories "That's a great photo. I'm thrilled with it. Leckie's company took me back. Every time I look at the photo, I see something different that jogs my memo ry, especially the gas lamps running up the brae, and I can still remember the gas man lighting them up at night. The photo was in my era, as Dod Dickson's car is in shot. We lived opposit e Dod's in East Arthur Place. I can see my ma's hoose from that angle, Dod's grocers shop, also Spier's the newsagents and the end of Prospect Street too." Eric Gold, East End, London, England: July 16+17+18, 2007 |
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4 Police "I don't recognise the bairns or the policeman. It wasn't ' Big Ginger, the Polis' (ha ha ha). He would just let us help ourselves." Eric Gold, East End, London, England: July 16+17+18, 2007 |
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5 Ginger "Eric Gold's mention aboot Ginger (the polis) brought back memories. We used to play fitba ('3 an yer in'). The goals were Cowan's big door, and Ginger often used to have a wee go before retiring intae his box (by the park gate) for his tea." Jim Di Mambro, South Africa: July 20, 2007 |
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6 Shovelling Coal "My fondest memory of the free coal was of a local character, Mrs. Wynn, shovelling it into her message bag ." Jim Di Mambro, July 19, 2007: Jim has lived in South Africa since 1973. |
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7 Arthur Street "My dad used to deliver coal to Arthur Street in the 1930s, firstly by horse and cart and latterly by lorry . He talked about getting stuck once with the loaded lorry about half way down the hill. For some reason, he didn’t think it was safe to go further down the steep gradient, but couldn’t get back up again until they had taken some of the load off. Needless to say, he was not short of locals to help him off load the bags of coal. However, there were lots of folks with black hands that day, and fewer bags got back to the top of the hill than they took off the lorry." Brian Gourlay, Biggar, Lanarkshire, Scotland, August 1, 2007 |
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8 Ginger "Eric Gold's mention aboot Ginger (the polis) brought back memories. We used to play fitba ('3 an yer in'). The goals were Cowan's big door, and Ginger often used to have a wee go before retiring intae his box (by the park gate) for his tea." Jim Di Mambro, South Africa: July 20, 2007 |
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9 Accidents "Arthur Street was very steep. There were many accidents there. A coal lorry and a sweet lorry both 'ran away' out of control down Arthur Street." John Ballantyne, Boswall, Edinburgh, August 31, 2007 |
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10 Children The best laugh was watching the men with their fruit-barrows . There were several of these being pushed around the streets, but when they came to the hill down Arthur Street, the owners had to hold on tight to the barrow handles to prevent the barrow from running away down the street. The local children knew this , so they used to run down the street beside the barrows, pinching the fruit, and there was nothing that the owner could do about it!" John Ballantyne, Boswall, Edinburgh, August 31, 2007 |
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11 My Sister "My sister is the little girl on the left in this photo. Does anyone know the date that the coal lorry crashed down the hill in Arthur Street?" Joe Coyle, The Inch, Edinburgh, October 22, 2007 |
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12 Horse and Cart "One winter in the early 1940s, half-way down the hill at the steps leading up to Salisbury Street, after a snow storm, Leckie's were delivering coal by horse and cart and unfortunately the horse slipped on the snow/ice and fell to the ground. After securing the load and uncoupling the horse from the shafts a number of men, using r opes and empty coal bags wrapped round the horse’s hooves, in an attempt to prevent further slipping, tried repeatedly to raise the animal. The more they tried the more fatigued the horse became. Eventually, after giving the horse food and water and allowing it to recover somewhat they managed to get it to its feet. I don’t think the horse suffered any damage as it managed to walk away (without the coal wagon). The whole exercise must have taken well over an hour to complete. As kids a number of us watched from the high wall at the foot of 'Soly'." Richard Martin, Borders, Scotland: August 5, 2008 |
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13 'Big Ginger' Found Me "I lived at 107 Dumbiedykes Road, and when I was only four years old, I ran away from home with my favourite blanket in my mum's washing-up bowl. 'Big Ginger', the policeman, found me up at the top of Dumbiedykes Road and took me back home. I remember him being very tall, with red hair, a short beard and a moustache." Susan Keaney, County Sligo, Ireland: October 8, 2008 |
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14 Picking up Coal Before my mother even saw this photo, she was able to tell me the name of the lorry, and that every kid in the place was sent out by their mother to pick up the coal on the road!" Theresa Carthy (née Lapping), Cork, Ireland: March 24, 2009 |
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15 Policeman "On the 2nd week of our Honeymoon, on arrival at the 2nd cottage, somewhere near Perth, I went to the adjoining cottage to collect the keys. The gentleman who answered the door got talking to me, asking me where I was from etc. On divulging that I once lived on Arthur Street, he became very animated, explaining that the thing he remembered most, was the coal lorry accident, because he had been the policeman who attended. He is undoubtedly the policeman in the photograph. Ray Murray, Waltham Abbey, Essex, England: July 27, 2009 |
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16 Hugh Leckie's Coal Deliveries "When I lived in Heriot Mount, coal was delivered by Hugh Leckie & Sons . The delivery man was only about 5ft 2ins and he had to carry a 1 cwt sack of household coal up 5 flights to our flat. We kept the coal in a bunker under the working surface top next to the sink. In the 1940s, our coal was delivered by horse and cart. I think I had left Edinburgh before he upgraded to a lorry." James Morton-Robertson, Sevenoaks, Kent, England: October 4, 2009' |
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17 The Driver "I've just come across the photo of the lorry in Arthur Street. I think that my late father, Andrew, may have been the driver in charge of the lorry. He stayed in Arthur Street and worked for Hugh Leckie before getting a job with Bruce Lindsay Waldie. I can remember him telling me about a problem he had in Arthur Street with a coal lorry" Brian Phillips, Edinburgh: August 2, 2010 |
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18 The Girl "The young girl at the front of this photo is my Aunt Amy . She lived in Arthur Street along with: - my mother, Catherine - my grandmother, Emily - my Aunts, Margaret and Ina. " Amy subsequently married Joe Wilson, a local joiner. They also lived in Arthur Street." Michael Fernon, Brisbane, Queensland, Australia: April 7, 2012 |
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19 November 1958 We now know when this accident happened. Here is another photo of the accident. It appeared in the Edinburgh Evening Dispatch on the day of the accident, November 15, 1958.
© Scotsman Publications Ltd. Click here for web site details. Licensed by Scran . Photo R02100467.jpg, Scran 000-000- 035-
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EAST THOMAS STREET TO THE WEST OF THE SOUTHERN END OF EASTER ROAD A few extracts from Recollections |
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Lots of recollections - to be added later |
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FOUNTAINBRIDGE A few extracts from Recollections |
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Lots of recollections - to be added later |
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JOPPA EAST OF PORTOBELLO A few extracts from Recollections |
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Eastfield terminus - Musselburgh Road
© Reproduced with acknowledgement to Adrian H Dodsley, Oakerthorpe, Derbyshire, who supplied this photo to me. |
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I received a lot of replies when I added this photo to the Edinphoto web site and asked: - "Was this photo taken at the Eastfield terminus beside the Firth of Forth at Joppa?" - "When might this photo have been taken?" Here are some of the replies that I received. |
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1 Eastfield "Yes, it is Eastfield. Behind the buses are what is now the Rockville House Hotel and in the distance Coillesdene House high flats which were completed and occupied in 1967." Archie Foley, Joppa, Edinburgh: August 23, 2007 |
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2 Eastfield It is the Eastfield terminus. The tall block of flats to the rear right of the 44 bus is Coillesdene House , whilst at far right of the picture you can see the very corner of what is now the Rockville Hotel." Mike Gradone, New York, USA, (formerly Dumbiedykes, Edinburgh): November 1, 2007 |
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3 TV Aerials "I see a pair of UHF television aerials on the house in the background, so I think that probably puts the photo into the 1970s . I think those aerials may be pointing to the Black Hill transmitter, rather than Craigkelly. I'm sure a Joppa local will confirm if there's a preference. I believe that Craigkelly was operational from September 1971 while the Black Hill was operational at the end of 1969." John J Hadden, Edinburgh: November 30, 2007 |
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4 TV Aerials "John J. Hadden's observation on the UHF aerials interest me. He quite rightly says that they are pointed towards Black Hill rather than Craigkelly. Sadly, this does not help to date the picture . I served my apprenticeship as a TV engineer. I recall being told that there were problems with the colour TV signal for people living close to the Forth, caused by the ebb and flow of the tide." Donald Grant, Penicuik, Midlothian, Scotland: February 19, 2008 |
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5 The Buses " The date of this photo is likely to be no later than August 1974. There was an article on the 26 bus route last year by Gavin Booth in 'Classic Bus' magazine. It gives Augus 1974 as the date when service 26 was converted to one-man operation . Another clue is given in the crest on bus 441, which is the Edinburgh Corporation Transport crest – this was replaced by the Lothian Regional Council one in May 1975, when the fleet became Lothian Region Transport (LRT). Going by what I’ve said above, and by Donald Grant’s information, this would appear to give a likely window of 'late-1971 / early-1972' for the picture." Steven Oliver, Duns, Borders, Scotland: February 35, 2008 |
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6 Destination "I lived about a mile up the road from Eastfield terminus from 1962 to 1979. A little clue in that the '26' is destined for Clermiston . For nearly every journey I took on the 26, it ran to Clerwood, about a half mile further on. Maybe the destination indicator is wrong, but this would place it in the 1960s if it was taken before the route was extended." Michael Thompson, Eastfield, Edinburgh, February 28, 2008 |
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1969
"If, as Michael has said, the bus was running to Clermiston and not to Clerwood, then it would date the photo as being taken between 1964 and 1967. BUT the television aerial on the top of the houses is shown as pointing to the Black Hill transmitter, and as Donald has mentioned, that came on air in 1969." S o, there are two possibilities for the No.26 bus: - It was either running to Clermiston as a short working, though it should have had 'Part Route' showing on the intermediate display if this was the case OR - The destination blind has been set incorrectly." Steven Oliver, Duns, Borders, Scotland: February 28, 2008 |
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8 Turning Circle " This photo shows a small turning circle at Eastfield: The Eastfield terminus had to be enlarged to accommodate more services and longer buses. Route 26 was converted to one-man-operation in 1970 [Calum Melrose - but in fact it was later. See] , so it seems likely that this enlargement of the turning circle would have been carried out during 1970." "So the date that the photo was taken is likely to have been early-1970 ." Steven Oliver, Duns, Borders, Scotland: March 14, 2008 |
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9 Early-1971 I thought that the correspondence on this topic might have come to an end. Then, after a gap of a couple of months, I received this a comprehensive reply from Denis Kelly, providing more answers and tying up a few loose ends. Denis suggested that this photo would have been taken in early-1971 . |
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Here are extracts from the answers that Denis provided. Thank you Denis. Advertisement "The advert on the route 44 bus displays ‘Ardmona’, an Australian fruit company who undertook a major sales initiative in this country in 1971 , advertising for the first time on Edinburgh buses." Bus No. 441 "The bus, fleet no. 441, seen in fine ‘ex-works’ condition was in service between 1954 and 1974, and not normally allocated to route 44 which from 1964 was the domain of Alexander-bodied Leyland Titans either like the bus on the left, new in 1964 or Titans of 1962. However a new route number 30 had started in November 1970 and the 1962 buses were transferred to work it. This meant overhauling and repainting older stock such as 441 and recalling them to route 44. By l August 1971 the new route was given new ‘One Person Operated’ (OPO) Atlantean buses so enabling the 1962 buses to return to route 44 and displace the older type." Destination Screens The destination screen on the route 26 bus is wrong. The bus ought to have displayed ‘Clerwood’. However it seems the original screens fitted to the bus (all this type had the newer screens) were being cleaned or repaired so older screens were fitted. These dated from 1952. ‘Clerwood’ (as a destination from 1966) wouldn’t have been included on these older screens, so the crew settled for ‘Clermiston’ . Turning Circle "Route 44 was converted to One Person Operation in May 1973, and route 26 in August 1974. The Eastfield lay-by , built in 1954, was enlarged later in 1971 to accommodate additional buses stopping there." Denis Kelly: May 26, 2008 |
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ST. LEONARD'S A few extracts from Recollections |
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Lots of recollections - to be added later |
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STOCKBRIDGE A few extracts from Recollections |
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1 Streetwise " In the season we would play conkers, climb trees, or play with fireworks ( It was more fun if you held them in your hand!) so we gradually developed a streetwise attitude , knowing people to avoid and where to hide when chased. " " The streets were our playground . We exchanged scraps and played : - Marbles along the gutters . ( There were not as many cars then . ) - Pierries (whipping a small wooden top along the street . If you had a good whip and a piece of hemp string you could make it jump and spin for hours!) - Diablo . - Hide and Seek - American and Japs - Cowboys and Indians - Robin Hood - Fencing with Sticks - Bows and Arrows - Aleavoy and other chasing games. Aleavoy was a chasing game played by two teams of about 5 or 6 kids (or more) . One team would hide and the other team would have to catch them. The boundaries were about a half a mile radius from the den, usually Portgower Place, and so, again, you learned how to : - run fast - climb walls - get into stairs without having a latch key - then go through the back greens and generally hide. These games all took place around the streets. You got to know the neighbourhood and all the children who stayed there. " Robin McAra, Trinity, Edinburgh: November 6, 2013 |
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1 Grieves' Dairy " In 1948 , my Mother bought Grieves' Dairy at 70 Raeburn Place. It was a 'wet' dairy . That mean t that the dairy bought its milk in churns , each holding 10 or 20 gallons . There was a machine into which the milk was decanted and where bottles were filled , 6 at a time . There were 4 sizes of bottle : - half pint - pint - pint and a half - 2 pints. So, we had to have hundreds of bottles ready with their cardboard stoppers . When the shop was quiet , we would be filling them up ready for the next day 's deliveries. This could go on into the night and we would get home at all hours. The bottles had to be washed when they came back from the customers. This was done in a large (8 feet by 4 feet ) galvanized bath in the back shop. Hot water and soap powder was used and there was a cylindrical brush attached to an electric motor. This was an ongoing job . We employed Mrs Forrest, who stayed in Bedford Street . She came in every day to wash the bottles and do any cleaning that we needed done. The milk we bottled was delivered by a horse was called Prince with his horse - drawn cart . Prince and the cart were housed in a mews off Dean Park Street , a run-down area where the rich ('the Ann Street mob ' ) used to keep their horses and carriages , with space above for their drivers to live. We employed a man to do the deliveries. " Working at the Dairy " Our life was getting up very early, 6a m , and going to the shop. We ate all our meals there, did our homework, socialised and helped out when we could . At night, around 11 pm, sometimes later , we went home once all the work was done. The dairy was open 7 days a week , and at Christmas and New Year we opened for half a day so that customers could get their cream and milk fresh . We also sold milk straight from the churn. The customers would provide their own jug and we’d fill it using a pewter measuring jug. When we went on to glass bottles the complaint was that the glass ' made the milk taste funny '." Robin McAra, Trinity, Edinburgh: November 6, 2013 |
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To be continued: more recollections have still to be added below. |
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www.edinphoto.org.uk
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Here is small selection of photos and a few index pages from 'EdinPhoto' web site but we'll probably not look any further down the page this evening. It's really the subject of a different talk! |
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Edinburgh Views
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